ikalvachev at gmail.com
Thu Jun 16 16:20:22 CEST 2016
On 6/16/16, Michael Niedermayer <michael at niedermayer.cc> wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 15, 2016 at 10:50:51AM -0300, James Almer wrote:
>> On 6/15/2016 10:14 AM, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
>> > Hi all
>> > As noone is doing anything about the situation and what is being
>> > done will not lead anywhere (the vote likely wont lead anywhere as
>> > likely few would ban a active developer 4 month and then if not
>> > some will feel injustice prevailed thus
>> > After writing this mail i will
>> > 1. ban carl for 24h from the ML due to
>> > causing derek to leave the project. (24h was suggested in the IRC
>> > meeting)
>> This is useless IMO. While four months is too much, 24 hours is
>> Let's not implement bans without a discussion and a vote first.
> I agree but if i do nothing people are unhappy that i did nothing,
> if i talk with people trying to resolve a conflict well, it did not
> work this time. and if i do something else people complain too.
> and its 4 weeks since the incident.
> Doing some symbolic action seemed to make sense until the people
> finish discussions and votes.
> I believe i do not have the authority to hand out real (week+) bans,
> nor would i want that authority. Also i will stay away
> from symbolic bans too, this was intended to improve the situation,
> and i believe it did not achieve that.
One way to resolve the matter as mature people would be
asking Carl to explain his words and actions in civilized manner,
then apologize for going over the board.
It is completely counterproductive to escalate the issue with
attempts for public humiliation and punishment,
without making attempts for addressing the bad behavior
they are supposed to stop.
>> The current vote will probably go nowhere, so a proper discussion thread
>> followed by a vote will have to be made.
> its up to the vote committee and the community to decide what should
> be done.
>> > I suspect carl saw the merges done by derek as causing more bugs than
>> > good so he attacked until derek stoped doing the merges.
>> Which is the shitty behavior that's being discussed about. When you find
>> problems you report them, or help fix them. You don't attack the person
>> working on them.
>> > The correct course of action would have been a vote about stoping the
>> > merges or a change to the procedure to reduce the amount of bugs.
>> > Like maybe a seperate branch where merges can be tested for ~24h before
>> > being pushed to master ...
>> > Or maybe more people working on fixing regressions
>> > As a sidenote, most of the regressions should be fixed by now.
>> > 2. ban derek for ~24h from the ML due to causing lukasz to leave the
>> > project last year, and due to personal insults on the ML and IRC
>> > to lukasz and carl.
>> > As derek is not subscribed to the list ATM, this will be implemented
>> > by moving him from the accept_these_nonmembers list to the
>> > reject_these_nonmembers list for ~24h
>> > 3. ban myself for ~24h from the ML because i wrote offensive mails too
>> > years ago and i doubt none was pivotal in causing someone to leave
>> And this is silly. It's old history and nobody requested such action in
>> any what whatsoever. It will only derail the discussion and again, bans
>> without discussion or vote are a big no.
> It may be unimportant but the "ban" would never have stopped derek from
> subscribing or subsequently posting a message.
> Michael GnuPG fingerprint: 9FF2128B147EF6730BADF133611EC787040B0FAB
> I have often repented speaking, but never of holding my tongue.
> -- Xenocrates
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